Appointments face to face?

Face to face appointments
Hi hope everyone is ok long time lurker lol. I signed up to uc in around march 2019 when I lost my job always had an online WORKCOACH but always had face to face meetings in jobcentre for my jobs each used to being big a4 book I use to write down jobs and things I was doing never used uc account to record job search on uc site
Fast forward to around 30 march 2020 when lockdown covid etc. started my online work coach said say could not be my work coach anymore and The office will be in touch with you in the future to let you know about your next appointment waited and waited but no appointments showed up in my uc account got random group messages for jobs saying This is a group message, please disregard if this does not apply to you did reply to a few group message asking for 1st, 2nd and 3rd job choices etc.
Did phone helpline and turn up at jobcentre but always told someone would be in contact etcTill 02/03/2021 got message from a Mark on my to do list saying I got Work Search Review on Monday 15th of March 2.30 by phone call I have being doing jobseach best could with everything going on. I find it easy to communicate face to face and would have no problem going to local jobcentre for job search reviews; I find it harder to communicate online or on the phone.

TBH don’t know what to do next is their anyway for face to face meeting or what rules are?

newclaim2021 wrote:Face to face appointments
Hi hope everyone is ok long time lurker lol. I signed up to uc in around march 2019 when I lost my job always had an online WORKCOACH but always had face to face meetings in jobcentre for my jobs each used to being big a4 book I use to write down jobs and things I was doing never used uc account to record job search on uc site
Fast forward to around 30 march 2020 when lockdown covid etc. started my online work coach said say could not be my work coach anymore and The office will be in touch with you in the future to let you know about your next appointment waited and waited but no appointments showed up in my uc account got random group messages for jobs saying This is a group message, please disregard if this does not apply to you did reply to a few group message asking for 1st, 2nd and 3rd job choices etc.
Did phone helpline and turn up at jobcentre but always told someone would be in contact etcTill  02/03/2021 got message from a Mark on my to do list saying I got Work Search Review on Monday 15th of March 2.30 by phone call I have being doing jobseach best could with everything going on. I find it easy to communicate face to face and would have no problem going to local jobcentre for job search reviews; I find it harder to communicate online or on the phone.

TBH don’t know what to do next is their anyway for face to face meeting or what rules are?

If you have difficulties using a phone/on-line services, DWP has a duty to make allternative arrangement.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/get-help-with-benefits-and-pensions-if-you-have-accessibility-needs

Thanks for your reply d.appleby, i dont really have an disabilty so what would my grouds be Thanks

newclaim2021 wrote:Thanks for your reply d.appleby, i dont really have an disabilty so what would my grouds be Thanks

Do you get anxious/tongue ties when you speak to officials/others on the telephone?

D.Appleby wrote:Do you get anxious/tongue ties when you speak to officials/others on the telephone?

Yeah i am very good face to face never had any problems, but phone and online can be tricky

Remember when you are volunteering information to the DWP it can be grounds to compel you to do other stuff as it may be seen as a "barrier to work".

If you say you struggle communicating on the phone and online you are effectively throwing that up as barrier to work; as in the current Covid climate that is where its all heading; online interviews, zoom meetings, recorded interviews via apps, etc etc.

You are then inviting them to fix that problem by extra support, referral to JETS Programme and other stuff.

My advice is do the phone call and see how you get on. Sometimes keeping your head down is the best thing to do

You cannot be compelled to accept any treatments for anxiety etc.

You can simply say that a face to face meeting would be very beneficial due to your particular circumstances.  DWP can also arrange a home visit if necessary.

Let us know how you get on.

I simply told them that I do not own a phone. They have no phone number for me. There is a bit of a back history to this but they now accept it even though new workers periodically ask me for my phone number and I have to re-explain that I have none.

D.Appleby wrote:You cannot be compelled to accept any treatments for anxiety etc.

You can simply say that a face to face meeting would be very beneficial due to your particular circumstances.  DWP can also arrange a home visit if necessary.

Let us know how you get on.

I dont claim to be a voice of expert opinion based on the technical rules and regulations and conditionality, my posts are just based on my own experience and reality of how it functions in the 'real world'.

Barriers to work are immediately picked up on by Jobcentre staff. You say "You can simply say that a face to face meeting would be very beneficial due to your particular circumstances" - but WHAT are these circumstances? The OP has already said he/she does not have a disability and is asking for examples of grounds they could use to get a face to face appointment.

Most job interviews are very unlikely to be face to face at the moment, so what if a jobsworth work coach pursues this line of enquiry with the OP?

There is a chance the OP's jobcentre will facilitate their request and get a face to face appointment.
Equally there is also a chance they will not.

It's all luck based on who you end up dealing with. Decent person or jobsworth.

We all (hopefully) know that there's a big difference between a phone call from a roach and being on the phone at work. It's not a barrier to employment to find it hard to communicate with a jobs-worth (as Parker points out) over the phone. It is anxiety provoking. However, the honest truth that most DWP employees are nasty pieces of work isn't across the board. My new work coach is ok. My advice is when you get the call simply ask the caller to give you some time to think of your reply as you get a bit flustered when you can't see the other person's face in order to pick up body language cues.

You don't have to be registered as disabled to request an alternative access method.  Explain what difficulties you have using the service, including anything that would help DWP understand your problem better.

I agree, communicating with officials can be stressful particularly when sanctions may apply.  You need to be able to present your work search in a way that benefits you.  Providing your jobsearch via email or face to face will help you to present your jobsearch more easily and effectively.  This way you avoid a potential sanction or being referred to inappropriate provision due to unhelpful communication channels.

Jobcentres are open and claimants can still request a face to face meeting.

There is a requirement for DWP to engage with claimants to support them in their return to work, help them to move closer to the labour market and to confirm that they continue to meet the conditionality requirements for receipt of their benefits. DWP will usually get in touchwith claimants by their preferred method of contact. If they do not wish for this contact to be made by telephone or text message, they can discuss this with their Work Coach. This being the case, they would need to attend face-to-face interviews as required. The UC journal can also be used to notify their contact preferences.

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/claimants_do_not_have_to_consent#incoming-1355708

D.Appleby, with respect you're just quoting FOI requests and 'regulations' and failing to look at the bigger picture, and reality.

Each to their own of course, but Absolut is spot on; most DWP employees arent these evil tyrants where you need to raise your level of paranoia to 100 at all-times. You just need to play the game. If you are dealing with a tyrant then absolutely throw the rules and regulations at them and use them to your advantage but I think the best advice is just to keep your head down and not draw attention to yourself. Until such time you know you're dealing with some jobsworth cretin, best keeping a low profile

And I can't think of anything drawing more attention to yourself than throwing FOI links or regulations at work coaches to get a face-to-face appointment during a global pandemic - especially when you're asking for suggestions as to the reasons you should say you want a face to face appointment on an online forum - when you haven't even had the phone appointment yet!

The reality of the phone appointments (I've been doing them for 8 months now) are just very mundane chit-chats. Nothing to worry about at all

At least have the first phone call, and hopefully you'll see what I mean. If not and you've unfortunately bumped into a horrible work-coach then you can start throwing the rules and regulations around. Just the way I approach things.

My roach has now put a F2F appt in the UCj for me but then followed up with a message (inc' sanction threats) about 'attending' a telephone appointment. I have asked this roach to clarify which it is. If it is telephone then I can remind them that I don't own one. Unfortunately, I suspect it is F2F.

More news as it is made.

I am back on Face2face meetings with the Roach. They said it was due to not having a 'Claimant commitment' Strange as I had 2x paper copies in my Dole folder, that I showed them....
I couldn't help thinking that its a " Carrot & Stick" ploy for me to get a phone? Still I dislike using the thing, so its also falling on deaf's...
Still I prefer the glass screen protector they have installed across desk. As it does make communication harder to hear each other 🤭....

I suspect since Job Centres have now returned to normal 9-5 opening hours we can expect to see  more face-to-face appointments being made.

The PCS (union which represents civil servants) has come out against a return to normal opening hours stating it would be reckless until a vaccine has been fully rolled out, especially with the doubling of front line Job Centre staff in order to deal with all the covid-related unemployment. They also state that the vast bulk of interviews can still be carried out remotely.

I have been told I will have one more digital meeting then face-to-face.  I have yet to tell them that this will not be a suitable arrangement for me

"You are then inviting them to fix that problem by extra support, referral to JETS Programme and other stuff.
"

This really does sum up effectively to what will happen should someone not comply with roach shop mentality. Taking into consideration Covid+  is still around, despite moron club saying ''all is well, fly off for your vacation'' I'd actually be insisting upon a phone appointment.

Cant see how anyone would want to engage face to face with these roaches unless they have, very little experience so far of doing so. Once experienced though, I feel the phone appointment method will become far more attractive. At least it was for me and i have no problem communicating verbally face to face. But I do, when it comes to having to engage with idealistic morons .

Newclaim2021
People can use UC journal to submit job search if they wish, send messages to roach etc. Very little needs to be discussed if roach is insisting on a 'chat on phone,' id ask them, 'to be specific about what that phone appointment will cover, that a text/journal message cant.

Some companies even conduct pre offer interviews by phone and as Parker123 says any mention of communication skills being lacking in regard to that will sure bring on a 'cat sat on mat course' ASAP. Could be wrong but, that's happened to some.

We were told our next appointment would be over the phone. A few days later letter sent - face to face appointment (for today) to "look at claimant commitment" and "agree your next steps towards looking for work" as if nothing has happened over the past year.

Funny that as my appointment is headlined as 'commitments meeting' but my current commitments are c6 months old and could not be more basic (look for 'any job I can do' , accept minimum wage, travel 90 minutes etc) so I can hardly be accused of limiting my options by committing to only look for specific jobs.

I believe this is a ploy to get claimants in the JCP 's. About not have a 'Claimant commitment'. When I last saw the Roach (last week) they commented that they didn't have a Claimant-commitment on the system for me. Hence that is why they needed to see me? Strange as i had two paper copies in my folder with me???🤨.

We turned up at the Job Centre yesterday to be told that the letter was a mistake, we were supposed to get a phone call, not be seen face to face, yet no-one rang so even that part wasn't properly booked. The office was empty (no claimants in there other than us). Chap we saw processed our claim and made an appointment for a phone call next time. He said they aren't expecting to be doing any face to face appointments until at least September.

Typical shambles at JCP similar happed to me at the start of this virus we all turned up yet we were meant to have a phone call. Def never happened.
   Left arm does not know what the right arm is doing springs to mind.
    Hope JCP is in walking distance Absolut or you can get your bus fair paid as around my way that would of costed me £10+ due to now needing 2 busses

I asked the roach the very pointed question (in the UCj - kept sceen-grab) what the appointment was about. The reply I got was that it was to 're-engage with customers' and to 'review their circumstances'. My circumstances have not changed so that just leaves re-engage then

Caker wrote:I asked the roach the very pointed question (in the UCj - kept sceen-grab) what the appointment was about. The reply I got was that it was to 're-engage with customers' and to 'review their circumstances'. My circumstances have not changed so that just leaves re-engage then

Jobcentre staff must specify the specific legal requirement to participate in an interview, which much include the specific reason for the interview and the consequences of non attendance/participation.

Extract...

9. As to the first point, Mr O’Regan contends that, on the facts, the
Appellant in this case was aware of a general obligation to take
part in interviews with his work coach when requested to do so.
However, Mr O’Regan concedes that there is ambiguity as to
whether the Appellant had been notified by the Jobcentre of the
actual substance of the requirement to take part in the telephone
interview and the consequences of non-compliance with such an
interview. Mr O’Regan continues as follows:
“14. … For example, it is not apparent from the appeal bundle whether the
interview was a ‘Work Focused Interview’ requirement in accordance with
section 15 of the Act and regulation 93 of the UC Regulations 2013; i.e. with a
view to assessing [the Appellant]’s prospects of obtaining paid work; or to
assist him in obtaining paid work; or to identify training or other activities that
would assist him in obtaining paid work and so forth, or, whether the
appointment was a verification appointment (a ‘connected requirement’) in
accordance with section 23 of the Act in order to impose a new work-related
requirement on [the Appellant], or to verify his compliance with a work-related
requirement, or to assist him to comply with an existing work-related
requirement. Unfortunately, this issue is made unclear owing to an
inconsistency throughout the appeal bundle as to whether the appointment
was a Work Focused Interview or, in fact, a review appointment (labelled as a
‘Work Focused Review’) (page 32 of the bundle; pages 44 to 47 of the bundle
and pages 52 to 53 of the bundle). Further to this, I also submit that it is not
clear from the appeal bundle whether [the Appellant] was adequately informed
of the consequences of any such failure to comply with the interview.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5fdc76ea8fa8f5148cb24bc9/CUC_0563_2020-00.pdf

You could request more information or just see what happens.

Thanks D.Appleby, I think I will ask them to be specific about the nature of the re-engagement and the actual agenda for the meeting.



As for the consequences of not attending, they were spelled out clearly.

Good luck Caker. Seems that, "consequences of not attending, they were spelled out clearly" is the only thing, their capable of communicating correctly...sometimes.