Has anybody been on the Work and Health Programme?

my complaint was sent to the  District Manager at west Yorkshire branch,
does any one know how long they can put you on daily signing for,as they call it. i am on universal credit,and don't sign anyway,
but if i do daily signing for say two weeks,ill do that, but any longer will be a pain in the ass
i have decided to say on my next visit on the 16th to say as its a voluntary course i don't want to go on it, if i have to do daily signing i will. as long as it does not go do a decision maker like she said on my last visit,i don't want a sanction,i am also moving on the 14th  and the property needs lots of work  painting decorating.

Committed Claimant wrote:You don't specify to whom in DWP you have made your formal complaint. So far your dispute is between yourself and your work coach and as such if you sent your complaint to a District Manager you would have wasted your time since they do not handle such complaints at an initial stage without it having progressed through the Jobcentre's own internal complaints procedures first.

If you intend to make a formal complaint it should be addressed in the first instance to you coach and copy to your Jobcentre manager. It should be in writing.  Have you got time before your next appointment to compile/arrange your response?

Having made several complaints about work coaches at a previous jobcentre, any complaint made to the jobcentre manager is a complete waste of time as they'll back their staff no matter what the complaint.

As Non_Deficere2 has stated, any complaint made to the district manager is the most effective, with your jobcentre and the work coach being sent a copy of your complaint, as well as it being forwarded to the CRT. In my case it usually resulted in a private meeting with my jobcentre manager to try to resolve the matter and in most cases resulted in me being moved to another work coach who'd be less demanding...

if nothings changed when i see my coach, to save all the hassle ill will be having,i might just go on the course,ive read that i can state i wont be doing the work experience when asked to do it , is this true,

Non_Deficere2

London123 is disputing his coach’s decision to refer him to the Work & Health Programme and trying to find ways to alter that decision.

Seems to me that’s what’s called asking for a Mandatory Reconsideration.

The link you give to Citizens Advice Information says:

If you don't agree with the outcome of a decision made by the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) or HM Revenue and Customs (HMRC) about your claim, you can challenge it.

To do this, you need to ask the DWP or HMRC to look at their decision again - this is called asking for a 'mandatory reconsideration'.
If you think the decision is wrong, you can ask for a mandatory reconsideration for any reason.  

And:

Challenging the decision is a separate process to complaining, but you can do both at the same time.

You can find out how to challenge a housing benefit decision on the Turn2us website. For all other benefits you’ll need to ask for a mandatory reconsideration.

Another link you suggested looking at says:

https://www.gov.uk/government/organisations/department-for-work-pensions/about/complaints-procedure

Mandatory reconsiderations and appeals are different

We can’t treat a complaint as a challenge to a benefit decision (a request for ‘mandatory reconsideration’) or an appeal against a benefit decision, overpayment decision, child maintenance assessment or sanction.

Read about how to request a mandatory reconsideration of a benefits decision.

You can’t appeal to the Social Security and Child Support Tribunal about a benefits decision until you get a response to your mandatory reconsideration request. This is called a ‘mandatory reconsideration notice’. You can appeal to the tribunal if you think the decision in the mandatory reconsideration notice is wrong.

Another of the posts you suggested says:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/local-partnership-opportunities-with-jobcentre-plus/jobcentre-plus-district-managers-contacts-for-partnership-opportunities

Jobcentre Plus District Managers  

District Managers are responsible for relationships with external organisations.

Contact them if you need to discuss how your organisation can work with Jobcentre Plus to help people back into work.  

I don’t know how you managed to resolve issues such as the one London123 raises here through a District Manager when all indications, DWP’s own procedures, suggest that it can’t be done.

If you are satisfied that London123 is on the right course of action all well and good. His psychic powers of predicting flu coming on should help him to foresee the consequences of a 3 year sanction and possibly loss of his housing benefit and the over 60s bungalow.

I wouldn’t dash out to buy any paint just yet though, plenty of time for it but may have nothing to paint.

CC,

London123's benefit has not been stopped so a Mandatory Reconsideration does not apply.

The current situation is, that a wrongful administration process has taken place so the complaint procedure applies.

Sending a complaint to the district manager expedites the complaint process from my experience.

The reason for all this is that my work coach told me it was a voluntary course, and now shes trying to bully me on to it,
by threats of daily signing , and decision makers,

london123 wrote:if nothings changed when i see my coach, to save all the hassle ill will be having,i might just go on the course,ive read that i can state  i wont be doing the work experience when asked to do it , is this true,

You cannot be mandated to undertake 'work experience' on any government scheme.

London123,

Did you receive this letter?

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/461555/response/1118128/attach/5/WHPL003.pdf

It seems that many don't receive the DWP referral letter, probably because it's made clear in said letter that they don't have to start the programme after 'consenting' to the referral.

london123 wrote:The reason for all this is that my work coach told me it was a voluntary course, and now shes trying to bully me on to it,
by threats of daily signing , and decision makers,

I'm sorry to read this absolutely appalling behaviour from a work coach towards you. There is no excuse for it. The work coach is a right nasty piece of work harassing you with no legal right to do so. ND has given you a great letter to send. I hope they will back off pronto.

Non_Deficere2 wrote:London123,

Did you receive this letter?

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/461555/response/1118128/attach/5/WHPL003.pdf

no letter,just verbal. i had one from reed explaining the skills they have to offer and a map of the directions to get there.

just had a message in my online journal,
I am Dina's manager. I have tried to call you a couple of times today to discuss your complaint. Please can you let me know when you are available for me to contact you.
but i have had no calls today ?

london123 wrote:just had a message in my online journal,
I am Dina's manager. I have tried to call you a couple of times today to discuss your complaint. Please can you let me know when you are available for me to contact you.
but i have had no calls today ?

I would respond along the lines..

Thank you for responding to my complaint.  If you need further information please contact me via my journal or by post.  

I haven't received any calls from DWP.

I would prefer a written response to my complaint.

just realized i had block unknown numbers on, on my phone, i had three calls from unknown numbers. so turned it off, i wrote in journal asking for him to call tomorrow morning, hope its good news, all this is causing me stress.

london123 wrote:just realized i had block unknown numbers on,  on my phone, i had three calls from unknown numbers. so turned it off, i wrote in journal asking for him to call tomorrow morning, hope its good news, all this is causing me stress.

I understand London123.

Hopefully, your concerns can be addressed via telephone. You can still ask for a letter confirming what has been agreed.

Complaints settled via telephone are not recorded as official complaints.

just had the call from a manager, i was told the daily signing is not a punishment it is there to help me get in to work.she said i will not be sanctioned, but she wants me to go on the course. and see how it goes, if i don't like it i can speak to my work coach and give her the reasons im leaving. so looks like im back on it,

london123 wrote:just had the call from a manager, i was told the daily signing is not a punishment it is there to help me get in to work.she said i will not be sanctioned, but she wants me to go on the course. and see how it goes, if i don't like it i can speak to my work coach and  give her the reasons im leaving. so looks like im back on it,

I'd ask for that in writing because it doesn't seem right that you're being pressurised to take up a voluntary programme when you've been very clear that you don't want to, and because the opposite of what the manager said is stated here:

If a participant is already on the programme as a volunteer and have disengaged and they reach the 24 month Long Term Unemployed (LTU) trigger point they must be mandated back on to the programme at this point and must complete the balance of time left on the programme.

http://data.parliament.uk/DepositedPapers/Files/DEP2018-0759/Work_and_Health_Programme_v5.0.pdf

I think you already have good reason not wanting to do the WHP - the harrassment and dishonesty of your work coach has already caused you immense stress and if the WHP coach really was shouting at your wc on the phone, that's surely an indication of how they'd treat you.

ill go on the course,but if they try to put me on any work placements.or work trials ill quit. and tell them that at the interview,

I hope you get this sorted to your liking London123. They nearly shafted me with this wonderful 'opportunity' and just manage to swerve it thanks to the advice of a few nice people on this forum.

Eventually, I feel they just try and send all to the slaughter WHP as soon as they possibly can. Bums on seats = £ for the provider company. The whole thing is one big sham and they should choose people more appropriately than their usual delusional warped sense of logic. Go on WHP and it will help you get in a 'job and stay in it longer  '

"just had the call from a manager, i was told the daily signing is not a punishment it is there to help me get in to work."

Ask this manager London123, do tell how they propose to do this. They're totally deluded and I've been out for 4-5 years and they haven't managed it yet. I'd say less is more, tell the planks that. Quality over quantity if there are actually any quality jobs still left they may suit you and you for it.




"i had three calls from unknown numbers."

Could also tell them while you on phone it's your personal preference not to take calls from unknown numbers .

london123 wrote:just had the call from a manager, i was told the daily signing is not a punishment it is there to help me get in to work.she said i will not be sanctioned, but she wants me to go on the course. and see how it goes, if i don't like it i can speak to my work coach and  give her the reasons im leaving. so looks like im back on it,

the manager is using a smoke screen and using spiel to get you onto this coarse

if you go on this coarse and leave you will face a sanction for it

best off refusing to go on any voluntary offering the dwp advice you to go onto it

daily signing was threatened because you refused to go onto a voluntary coarse

Admin wrote:the manager is using a smoke screen and using spiel to get you onto this coarse

This is very true.

I don't think you'd be sanctioned for dropping out of the WHP if your referral was voluntary, but you would be mandated back onto it by the looks of this:

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2017/1020/pdfs/uksiod_20171020_en.pdf

There's a slight chance you wouldn't be mandated if they accepted that you had good reason, which I know is more or less what they said to you, but you would be placing your trust in them...

If I remember rightly, Catwoman was threatened with daily attendance (and referral to a decision maker) after failing to start the WHP. Neither happened, although I think they put her on weekly signing for a short while.

London123,
You can only be mandated to the W&HP if you meet the following criteria:

Long Term Unemployed Participants
14.Participants will be deemed to be Long Term Unemployed when they reach the following point in their benefit claim:
JSA Participants at 24 months including linking periods
UC Participants who start in the IntensiveWork Search Regime (IWSR) and are in the IWSR when they reach 24 months discounting change of circumstances within the 24 month period and
Participants migrated to Universal Credit Full Service (UCFS) from legacy benefits will be considered when their time on legacy benefits including linking rules andtheir time in the IWSR totals 24 months.
15.Participants who have completed WHP in England or Waleswill be excluded. The Work Coach will also consider whether a Participantshould be Exempt from WHP or whether participation should be deferred.
16.Whether eligibleParticipants access the WHP will be determined by a process of random allocation.If a Participantis randomly allocated, they will be referred by the Work Coach to the supplier on a mandatory basis.
17.These Participants will be referred on LMS/WSP using the opportunity type WHP LTU and WHP Minister LTU(please see Annex 1)

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/834502/work-and-health-programme-provider-guidance-chapter-2.pdf

You cannot be mandated to attend daily at the Jobcentre without a rational reason.

https://respectfulbenefits.forumotion.com/t4233-daily-signing-attendance

at the moment,no ones told me how many days a week i am expected to addend the course,or what it entails, i assume the usual cv writing skills and interview skills, that i have done lots of times in the past,i was also on the work program a few years ago,

london123 wrote:at the moment,no ones told me how many days a week i am expected to addend the course,or what it entails, i assume the usual cv writing skills and interview skills, that i have done lots of times in the past,i was also on the work program a few years ago,

It will be different for every person. The main focus is matching you to employers.

What you’ll get
You’ll get personal support to help you:

identify your employment needs
match your skills to work that’s available
put you in touch with employers
find long-term employment
get training to help you find work
manage health problems to reduce their impact on work

https://www.gov.uk/work-health-programme